24- Healing and Recovering from Sexual Abuse

A brought to you by volume only see research length can bring many difficult situations, domestic violence, addictions, poverty and even sexual abuse by your loved ones welcome, Amy, and the Q campaign have no care when I'm fighting the cell can be found in God is the.com to podcasts ourselves cover topics like how to heal after trauma abuse, mental illness, common misconceptions, treatment options, healing options, providing positive behaviors.

So basically if you are suffering from anything or if you've suffered with it and try to find ways to help you. As for me I'm a survivor and I can offer my testimony but I also invite professionals in the field such as psychologists are experts or survivors that become speakers and incredible stories, testimonials that are sure to inspire and to see we can talk about how the piece, which should not be an implicit topic to talk about a necessary topic to discuss. Because the statistics say that one in five girls in whiny lease with experience sums sort of child abuse before the age of 18. So today we have a special guest. Her name is Miranda attempt Jana excuse me but Jana Jana is a master. She has a Masters of social work. She's a writer, a speaker survivor whose work has been featured in the Huffington Post, the mighty psych Central trigger points anthology moms rising, and others. She writes about a variety of subjects including recovery from abuse and family estrangement parenting and grief. Miranda has spent over two decades addressing and examining family responses to the disclosure of child abuse.

She is the creator of the online resource. The second coping with family while healing from abuse and insults so am also here joined by Dr. Boris Niccolo hello and I believe Miranda's with us right now. Oh hello Miranda, how are you I thank you so much for having a show hello think you and II found that what you do extremely interesting because any abuse is very prevalent to say that the problem is is that it proceeds fostered in silence. When people talk about the weather.

One of the major problems about talking about it is the stigma that you won't be believed is that you ashamed of anything you think it's something that if the lack of education that you touch something very interesting which is family estrangement because that's my own personal experience my mother choose chose not to believe, and even in today's world.

My oldest daughter now doesn't believe me. Once I have a dysfunctional family looking you did that. Maybe you can tell us a little bit about this since you are the creator of the second won't God thank you topic that is Garrett my heart because I have lived through as well and let me say I'm so sorry to hear that you had his experiences. It really is a revictimization after having already been through the trauma of abuse and the painful work of of acknowledging it and trying to heal from it on and while we can control to some extent the work that we choose to do as survivors to heal from arch, we can get therapy and and attend support groups in reading got a lot of support after the fact. The pain of having family not believe or not supported us.

Not only that, but also re-victimize us and I can talk more about that but hurt us in various ways is something that often I would say usually doesn't. And so it's some people and I speak a lot of survivors and and often they tell me it's more because it doesn't have any endpoint.

I understand the last time that I saw my mother giving birth to my daughters and yell was almost called guilt has a severe brain injury highly inflexible. So the father speaks my mother got her to not believe me and so can volume for the rest of your life even if you speak to the dysfunctional family anymore. That could be somehow in connection anything come back to hurt you lately and it that you can work on it works. You understand that, and it can have less of a sting over time, but it never really goes away in our care. Mother's Day is coming up in a couple days and I'm sure you and I and and you have double reason for it to be no less than a celebration. These are painful moments for us and I don't have a lot of contact with my mom.

I do have some but it's always complicated, and it's usually more peaceful when you know are not in touch but would you like me to talk a little bit more about that common family dynamics that happen with the second wound or I can tell my story and then describe more about sure to my experiences that I came from a large family and I child about that between about the ages of seven and nine. You know my memory isn't perfect, but I never actually forgot my abuse. I always was aware that I remembered it just didn't know what it was and didn't know how to categorize that but I was sexually abused by my older brother and it did and it some point, you know, around nine or cannot. I'm not exactly sure why. I think that I actually was able to stand up to him or we might've even been discovered.

I don't know exactly but it was. Not every dresser talked about for something that I was very very ashamed of and felt that I was very different from everybody else. I knew because I had experienced the things I knew things that I felt I shouldn't know.

I felt like I lost my innocence, and I carried that you know throughout my whole adolescence and it really affected me and it so it was really sort of a common story is that it wasn't until I left home and I built a life away and it was safe that I was able to start addressing this. So I was in my mid-20s I was married happily married to really supportive man and lived an hour away from my family. I had been in therapy for a couple years really trusted my therapist and I finally decided you know what this is something I need to talk about and I actually was in graduate school for social work at the time and this just shows how strong denial can be set. I didn't categorize my experience of sexual abuse, even though I knew all about sexually is understood it as a practitioner I understood what it meant to other people was never able to apply that to myself, so she was wonderful. She really help me work through a lot of my husband was incredibly supportive. Thank goodness because that was really on my healing pretty quickly. Pretty early on. I did reveal it to my family and my story is that I hundred percent with convincing, it never occurred to me that there is any other option that my family would say oh no this is also worth a sorry let's all look at what happened in heal together and you could call me naïve, I don't. I don't really see myself that way because I think that's how it should have happened, but unfortunately life is more complicated than that in people you know I don't always have those abilities so my experience was actually quite different. Even though my brother pretty quickly and admitted that there was trail and my family never doubted me, and at first had the right things, which is a lot of things that many survivors dream of having happened on. I can play that these things alone know aren't really what they seem when because actions speak louder than words and and what happened over time with.

I began to discover that my family did not want to address that they did not want to talk about it. They did not want to look at it.

They do not want to hold my brother responsible now.

He was also a child and I I understood that I understood that the fact that he done this meant that something terrible probably happened to him that he was a child and even a child is in trouble. At the time. So that's why I thought we should heal together with angry at him for things that happened in our adulthood and for what he had done what I I was open to working together in healing together and in fact that's not at all how it when it was he was very very angry at me for trying to tell him how his actions had hurt me and he was aggressive in rejecting so I was hurt by that, obviously, an expected my mother and my family to support me, you at least understand noise coming from and so over time.

What happened was with a story that I have learned is I don't even worry universal for people whose families don't understand it but it's I really discovered this pattern. These symptoms these manifestations of the second wound of the three victimization that happened over and over. It's 1/3 of the same story and so many survivors lives and their certain components to it even you know whether families believe you are not, they will often minimize it to the point where they just want to brush the abuse under the rug and as he put it on your in trial.

It's it's really insidious and dangerous to email. Keep a silence about sexual abuse. That's how it fosters is how it continues into the next generation. And this is the chair listening to Amy Havel was speaking to Miranda was speaking to the doctor. He second owns and were talking about abuse. What are the stations of the abuse in Iran that you touch something very interesting that they don't want to believe it and it's almost people don't want to believe the choose one. It's ugly and your situation was unique because this is a mother that wants to love both her children think she has to discipline one side of the other and that's very difficult for his mother's even in today's world, the revictimization leaning victim. It occurs and occurs more than you know. Even my daughter's school student of hers was being inappropriate on face time with with my daughter. My daughter eventually hung up the phone. She didn't do anything. She went to the school told the school told principal emailed this kid wanted her to stop her close or something like that just inappropriate for third fourth grade so you know she but she was feeling very bad and very guilty so she goes to her teacher for help. And when I come to the school years crawling superhard. She's been suspended from school.

They say she's just the OTS hand, I do not believe it. Do you imagine after being victimized herself and being gleaned myself as much as I want to safeguard my child. This happens in today's world believe it, but it is shocking and backward and classic victim blaming in a situation that to me is pretty cut and dried. Especially with the child of her age. She goes for help that she said to me, mom said anything. Mom was bad. Why did I see something this how we want children to feel we as adults should be responsible enough give the child that then is benefit of the crop you know of the of the point, you know just now just try to please them.

Children normally don't lie about these things. This is not a thing now and got arrested for public. Upsetting lesson he learned from her school yeah you know what I think the way that we can and also parents need to know how to recognize sexual misconduct when it comes to children because sometimes Cogen will not talk know we can to do with daily gobble to work on 80 50 here today were talking about the effects abuse and have a special guest event that you think that was an incredible abuse survivor earlier talking about how sometimes it's difficult for kids to talk about abuse were to come forward because one of the things that really hurt is that our caretaker or family may not believe us.

Sometimes people go into denial because they can handle somebody very close and produce such an awful thing, whether it be the husband or their son and his mother's. We cannot understand it because we try to be a good mother.

We completely the opposite. We want to protect our child and it's something that's difficult front to what aspiring to understand the sea got this a very nice thing he puts in your path. If you families not putting a pot somebody that will be for Miranda was a psychologist, a social worker and her wonderful husband for me. It was maybe some medication over time.

My husband music and a lot of other things that Miranda has great insight to tell us about how you from not being believed, especially from those who are supposed to care about is the most okay Miranda so I'm sorry to have a dime to break that you were saying something that seemed interesting.

We were talking about, you know that you're telling us how year mother didn't believe you, and how sometimes is difficult for kids to speak and get snow this kids know that they may not be believed, that they might be blamed that they might be re-victimized. I mean they really know. So if Rick appearance unlike our payments if we wanted to do the right thing. How can we recognize the warning signs of sexual misconduct. What if you extract your children are victims of abuse while they that my mother didn't believe me. My family didn't believe me.

But now is explaining that although people think that that's that would be the answer. It's often the case in mind that my family minimize debt and wanted to brush it under the rug and not not address that one of my concerns all along was that that you know you need to be cognizant of the next generation and protect. And so if there is ever someone who has a history of perpetrating we have to be very careful about having minors present with that person now looking into whether there okay or not to you.

If they really gotten help, and even even if they got help.

I personally wouldn't leave a child with someone you know in the care of someone who had this kind of history is important to break the cycle because his visa: the fact that the abuse is often most often by the way, virtually someone you know what trust that a family member or friend your child's best friend, the teacher Niebuhr a coat or even a sibling. A lot of times their award-winning coaches in the video that will people and it's the sin that because people have this idea of what an abuser should be so. This person then is so nice and so they very never leave it in the kneeling years and you don't want people believe what they want to believe unfortunately that is the reason I like your saying perpetrator is especially true pedophiles will agree not just the child but the family and sometimes with public figures telegram the public on as in the. The documentary the recent documentary about Michael Jackson on it when you went over the public. You have that kind of platform it's very easy to then get people to trust you and want to be around you and be in the glow of your fame you should mention the Michael Jackson you know documentary because I found an article that's very interesting at first they beat the child's mind in order to read their body and the regulators first step is to isolate the child they become the child is confident very much like the Michael Dennis study movie you know the start you know they get into the social life except texting them. He spoke the know they tried out there things that you mean they want to look to spend a lot of time with the kids. I noticed my mother would surround herself amend love to be with us kids and only the kids and it's something going on usually pays attention to, and then quickly turns over to conversation with an adult, but that adult that ignores the adults and continues talking with the kid and seems too interested in the kid. That's a red flag right about your daughter that one of the main reasons that that is concerning is because you children. One of the best way to keep our children safe is to educate them about the what is appropriate and what is not, and that they have a right to not only say now but that the important thing is to go and report if someone is making them feel uncomfortable in any of these ways. Now you really clear with no shame about what is appropriate and what's not and what and that your body is your your way and you have a right to say I'm not comfortable with any physical with certain physical interactions, etc. on what an appropriate grooming like Joseph sexual nature V. Sexual innuendo, provocative discussions of personal life and you know inquisitive conversations about the students life.

You know it.

If the teacher freaking hall passes angling at this either on or off means. I know that even using that means it was okay to be at that. I thought it was okay to be the teacher spread that some things that you should consider not so much that it's given just to look into it. Signs and symptoms your daughter with her daughter did the right thing and I will relate proud and impressed with her that she used her voice to speak up and into the fact that the school system who has such authority and such. You know, important to her child would respond that way reinforces the wrong message which is that she should be ashamed. She should feel ashamed and that she doesn't have her way to speak up to protect herself and that's really the exact wrong message and what we want to get the children to keep them safe throughout life's this is a spiritual school so I expected to do the right thing just as well yeah I mean that that does that is something that the stomach and a lot of institutions and obviously the Catholic Church has a major issues about that are being revealed.

I know in my state I'm in Connecticut and the parochial schools.

At least I know some in particular, and I'm not sure what the state laws are but they believe even the parochial schools are mandated to teach the educators and to some extent the kids about on about these dangerous and are also mandated mandated reporters have to report anything suspicious.

They see within hours or they can actually be criminally liable show my daughter's school and my doctor sings and one that shows that the talent show is maybe eighth grade boy African-American and too little blonde what's about the same height of the Michael Jackson victims and they were singing a Michael Jackson song.

Wow. You know what if people just like Hitler, or people on when that hurt people's feelings.

Shouldn't they be aware that Michael Michael Jackson while he hadn't been convicted or not. There's so much out there that we can look at and you know at least be very alarmed by his behavior and not hold him continue to hold him up as an idol to kids that that would concern retail and unfortunately I think that that's really widespread kind of attitude because again like you're saying just like family members don't want to believe it. I don't want to look at it, you know that the common response in part because of the culture we we are comfortable with addressing sexual abuse it's it's a difficult topic at the painful topic. A lot of people have been touched by it and haven't been able to heal from it yet and maybe they shy away from it from. For that reason. There's all kinds of reasons, but we need to overcome them.

Since Chris on and it really is a silent epidemic that that's likely some years that we can reach other think that God loves us and hearts that we can share stories and testimonials and be there for each other so that Don produced in a this is that your hosting a capo, we speak about abuse had overcome eight weeks of healing. If you're suffering if you suffered we can try to help you if you suffer from persistent depression call neurosciences medical clinic to schedule a free consultation for new, effective FDA approved treatment such as intranasal ketamine or Norstar TMS. No medication treatment neurosciences medical clinic call now 786-600-7005 neurosciences medical clinic 786 600-700-5786 600-7005 and now we continue with baby gobble in the 218 80 have all the care and I despite that song don't and that you know when I hear that song. One my for the two of us I think of God because because Mike did not believe me and my entire family kind of abandon me because of our faith to know people tend to back me and people betrayed me as dismaying God, and it was one like for the two of us that when people don't believe this is important to break the cycle and there's a misconception that because your family's abusers or your appearing thing, you're likely to abuse to children goes down through generations and that's not true. You can do exactly the opposite in the round out but she is a perfect example of that any round that really see. See the online creator of second and it's a very interesting point of view because it happens more often than we know. People don't want to believe us Miranda tell me how you think about what dates you do to get to and what was that point in time that they okay this is it. This is my last hurrah make it right this time underneath the rest of my life better. Well, very survival and think it got me through my childhood and it brought made at a pretty young age. To address this and really motivated the healthy are emotionally and to be able to enjoy my life more and not be saddled with so much anxiety and and sadness that came from the same that I have carried and I really was able to do that work at it with hard work with my therapist. I can tell you that I really delve into it and I I was very I would say I was depressed I had serious social anxiety for Goodyear as I really became in touch with the pain that I carried along the end of that year. With the help of my husband, my therapist, my closest friends I really emerged from it a different person with a newfound confidence and that grew you know what that wasn't the end it was sort of the beginning still but it has grown over the years and I know in some ways being in therapy for a long time, which I have been on and off over the years. It helps you handle life in the you really examine things carefully and examine yourself along the way and it can help you evolve faster even you know by them I can I can talk a little bit about what was most useful for me in my healing and what I recommend other survivors who are dealing with this.

Yeah.

So in addition to therapy group therapy or core support groups are really valuable in a way that therapy alone is not quite able to give you which is the feedback from your peers that that your okay that you're acceptable that you're even lovable and that doesn't change who you are that you experienced this and I can tell you that when I first I was in the support group.

It wasn't about sexual abuse. It was just a support group for women that my therapist ran and I used to think nicer verbalize this when I told my closest friends about what happened to me when I first began to speak actually thought they were going to see me as painted and I would say things like, if you really want to tell your husband about it. I trust you can call him, but only if he won't think I'm gross they would say I don't know why you would ever think that Miranda you know anyone else experienced a family member, not believing that believing that and if you'd like to share with us or ask this question with you, for you.

The numbers 844-7279 92 again 844-7799 Miranda later. Simon, I wanted to touch on is that connecting with others in our relationships with other people and I have talked about that but I just wanted drive it home. Whether whether it parse our partner, our child, our friends, I therapist that connecting with other people is the way that we heal and it's it's especially difficult because our relationships and interactions with other people are what hurt a sword.

Yes, we need to be careful and really think that often times when we grow up with abuse you. You're right, it doesn't mean that you are going to abuse.

In fact, it's a very small chance and if that were true, we have far more female abusers than male abusers based on the statistics is Hollywood describes it different. They always use all of the perpetrator was abuse themselves and scene not curio but inhabited more complicated story. Reyna doesn't mean that you're going to going to be about all and in fact many people who have abusive childhood developed a kind of empathy that is very powerful because they know what it means to be in pain often also you need to develop a certain kind of what what becomes empathy need to be able to read people's moods and energies in order to keep yourself safe in a family that's not safe to write so we develop these skills and we can use them for good or we can use them for bad some people do use them to manipulate and abuse, but to be able to heal slowly but surely through interactions with other people and learn what kind of relationships are healthy. What boundaries are healthy and slowly form connections that are safe and valuable and you know know nothing is perfectly safe, loving people, means we hurt each other inadvertently. That's part of life. We can grow and heal from that and do better but it's so important. I completely understand.

It's very very important because there's nothing more beautiful things human interaction.

You know it's wonderful that you had therapist and that you were able to to support group and stuff like that because there's nothing wrong with admitting we need help from what I was going to say especially for male victims. I think it can be really hard to admit that you need help. It doesn't mean you're weak.

If anything it takes a lot of strength and courage to acknowledge it and get help. Yes. For example, when I went to the psychiatrist I was. I was facing happens to me and I did not want to talk to her so just go there quite medication.

Give her speak so that that wasn't what they did for me had a very supportive husband. I didn't know good therapy for everybody that I find having been part of the group in Facebook. I find that helpful because I read that I thought nobody else knew about nobody else would think of but he looks somebody else is going to this in somebody else's managing and it's not only me, and I'm not alone and people to understand and people do quick care they can't see me.

So that's how I can do it very one of the wonderful things about social media.

There's a lot of down the media, but yeah and I and my side. I have a call coming through my front but I do have a Facebook page, Instagram and Twitter and website where I post every day articles and messages about this exact topic I can tell you that when I was discovering my family's reaction time it took me a while to come to terms and understand what my family's reaction really was because they were they weren't blatant about it. They don't they didn't say we don't believe you. We don't support you, they said, we do believe you and support you and then they went on to not believe or support me to ostracize me from the family and victim blaming father when I was seven years old and it was very evident that he was sexually abusing leader, never to be spoken against the family and abuse the more physically all that awful and it I'm so sorry that's not how it should be. Mother should be should protect us and unfortunately your story. I hear again and again and again. It's not too long ago. Thank God for the hard times because that's when I need to have faith the most one like this I get, the stronger my faith because so yeah, life's problems don't really bother me.

Yes, I'm sad about my daughter.

I don't know love her. I don't know she's been injured. I don't think she can make it on her own. I wanted to be there for her and wanted to please her the right way that you know my dysfunctional family was happy about my memoir and while you can't get it if you dysfunctional family. Sometimes they just there, you can try that somehow the family. It's your extended family and it is what this doesn't mean you have to condone it that you have to be aware with. Sometimes you have to deal with it and sometimes had to deal with it painfully yummy. You know, I trust God and hazy in his hands, just like a lift in his hands. The day that I thought she would die when she was in a 24 day, her doctor for many of the survivors that I interacted on that faith can be extremely helpful and extremely comforting and we know in a way that that can fill not replace what you, your family could have given you, but fell to hold their decent, from the support I needed from God's order to have God in order to feel like a cut for me I change my ways. I had to become the person I should be. I wanted and I and I started doing positive things.

Things that I neglected when I was depressed. I didn't do my dogs. I was in cleaning the house. I wasn't taking care of myself. I didn't minimum this was throughout the custody battles.

I was single mother. Family and it was very difficult, but I always knew that I can come to God and helped help me through it all, probably have a church community as well.

Well I don't really go to church months that I feel like getting my kids in Catholic schools getting off and guilty of one of those parents try trying to get to the point that I had a different run-ins with Catholics, and I wanted to be nondenominational that I can't deny it empathic for rosaries but.

But I do find comfort in my kids that are so cute.

My dogs that you know there are some loving music. Happy moments God has it been possible that I can be so happy over a song over little things in Angel you like, you know what if I didn't see justice. This is just the fact that I can feel happiness. The fact that I can be kind. The fact that I can be hopeful.

The fact that I feel peace and now you break me know. Thank you devil next. I have 1 More Way that I would. I would like to leave listeners when and not that one of the hardest thing about recovering from the second wound or or dealing with, etc. know if you can ever recover from it because it tends to linger on. But as your family continues to respond that way but it can be very confusing to know that the messages you get a free it from your family are correct when they're telling you that it's the year that year. The problem, and if you would just be quiet and stop harping on this quote unquote move on. Everything would be okay and I have a line that I use which is you are not the troublemaker you are the truth teller on and really it's an unhealthy system. Any any system any family that supports abusers and denies and covers about use and shames victims an unhealthy system and so if you're the one that is the black sheep and you're the one that cannot work in that system doesn't mean you're wrong. It probably means that you're healthy grateful guy. Thank you so much.

Thank you so much for being with us and thank you for sharing your story and I'm going to put all the links to your website or your information or your book as well as any other guest on my website.insecure.com so if anybody wants to know more about this or speak to any of our guests including Miranda, then you're welcome to.

This is Dick here. I'm your host, any capital until next Friday. He will speak again if you suffer from persistent depression: neurosciences medical clinic to schedule a free consultation for new, effective FDA approved treatment such as intranasal ketamine or Norstar TMS. No medication treatment neurosciences medical clinic call now 786-600-7005 neurosciences medical clinic 786 600-700-5786 600-7005 with Amy Coble was brought to you by volume ICU research 786-310-7477 or www.God's word.com to noon every Friday at 2 PM with baby, right here on the